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ARTHUR:
Sleek has pointed out that we're only getting one filtered side of the Bobby Ryan negotiations.  I don't believe that's true.  Most of us are probably only FOCUSING on one side of the Bobby Ryan negotiations, but Bobby went to the press himself before the numbers came out.  Still, it's hard for platitudes to stand up against contract figures, and that's why Murray is currently winning the PR war.  

But let me emphasize one thing.  This is about term.  I overheard a lot of people at the Ducks' Conditioning Camp talking about how 'greedy' Bobby was for turning down five years at 25 million, which is perfectly valid if they meant to say that he wants to hit the open market in 2014 and collect as much money as possible from whatever team will pay it-- but that's not what they meant.  This is about term, and I suppose Bobby could give some of the money to charity after he signs to re-enforce that it was about term, but that never seems to work.

With Pierre LeBrun releasing the last two offer numbers  (five years, 25M and 4 years, 18.4M), it's time we took a look at how this has played out in the press.  BOTH sides after the jump...

Star-divide

On November 21, 2009, Pierre LeBrun reported for ESPN.com:

I'm told the Ducks made Bobby Ryan an offer last month but was rejected. Contract talks are now off until after the season.

As I recall, the offer above was a 'feeling out' offer, nothing significant.  Ryan's agent, Mark Guy of Newport Sports Management told the OC Register that discussions went well but both sides would wait to see how the season progressed.  Bobby added:

All I know is that it didn’t get near the point to where it was time to bring me in and sign on the dotted line.

After signing Jonas Hiller in January, Bob Murray offered a number of platitudes to the OC Register regarding Ryan (that he wouldn't trade him, specifically) but also reiterated his formal position, which seems to be: No rush.

...Bobby Ryan is a restricted free agent. So I basically have until next December 1 to get him signed. I don’t see it going that route. We’ll sit down...We’ve got all summer. Nothing’s going to change between now and the summer. Nothing can change.

Murph's 'no rush' mantra goes hand in hand with his 'plenty of money saved up' mantra, which he expressed in the Fan Forum Teleconference thusly:

We're in good financial shape.  There won't be anywhere where a team feels like they can do what they did with Dustin Penner-- walk in here and floor us with the thing and have us make tough decisions.

Practically inviting an offer sheet and setting a very long timetable, talks didn't resume during the season.  However, in April, Ryan offered some thoughts to the OC Register on where potential talks would go, saying he didn't see himself signing a five-year deal like Getzlaf and Perry and that a contract taking him to unrestricted free agency might be better.  He emphasized he was interested in a long term deal, but that the CBA might get in the way:

 "When we talked earlier, we touched on it," said Ryan, referring to a deal stretching many years. "Nothing really came of it and nothing really materialized either way. Bob Murray was a little more concerned about the CBA (collective bargaining agreement) next year and where that was going than doing a long-term deal.

"I’d love for a long-term deal. I think everybody knows that. But I think it’ll end up being the opposite for now."

At the end of May, Don Meehan of Newport Sports Management confirmed to the OC Register that talks had resumed, but three weeks later, Ryan told the paper he was "kind of worried" as he hadn't heard "a single peep" on negotiations.  However, he also acknowledged that he understood the process, that Corey Perry's negotiation came down to the last minute, and if his went even longer then he would, of course, have to look at offer sheets.  Perhaps the most eye-catching portion of the interview seemed to be Ryan's indication of an asking price:

"Not even close," Ryan said of seeking comparable or better salaries. "I completely understand that nobody makes more than Getzlaf and Perry. I have no problem with that. I never expected that. I know those are the two guys and we build from there.
"I also feel like in the past couple of years, I played in a position where I can be mentioned among them."

Ryan then reiterated his desire to stay in Anaheim and the trust he had in Newport Sports Management to make it happen.  However, his suggestion of an asking price wasn't lost on Bob Murray, who acknowledged that negotiations hadn't progressed, but claimed he was surprised at Ryan's comments.  The Ducks GM fired back with vague negotiation details five days later, telling the Register

He acknowledged the lack of progress but revealed that "we made him a pretty good five-year offer between $20-25 million."
"I’m not going to tell you where, but between there," Murray said. "That is not chump change."

Murph also added his now trademark catch phrases, which ring a little different on June 24th than they had in January:

I’m in no hurry to do anything whatsoever.
If somebody wants to give him an offer sheet, we have lots of space. We’ll match.

That takes us to July 1st, where Bob Murray dropped a bomb of exact figures that Ryan and his agents had turned down before noting he was "done for a while."  In speaking to the Register he offered this:

"We went to five years at $5 million a year, thinking that after what I heard him say last week that it would be very close," Murray said. "We offered him a four-year deal at a lower number and they flat out turned that down as quick as you can say whatever you want to say."

Don Meehan offered only this in response:

I gave my word as part of an agreement with Bob Murray that we would not negotiate this transaction through the media and I will continue to keep my word in that respect.

 

That brings us up to date in a press war that Bob Murray is currently winning, and that's not really a surprise.  Fans are likely to side with the guy still cashing checks that say "Ducks," and it's hard for a player to explain why he's turning down big dollar signs, even if the details of the negotiation or the collective bargaining agreement are heavily in play.  From here, as LeBrun guesses, we may be waiting for an offer sheet.  If both sides agreed on anything, it was that negotiations weren't going anywhere before they went to the press.  

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Not gonna lie, I’am losing alot of respect for him with this. Just because you were drafted behind Sidney Crosby does not mean your as good as him.

by JD54 on Jul 7, 2010 1:06 PM PDT reply actions  

The guy is entitled to seek what he thinks is fair value. What we are witnessing, is probably just a young guy messing up his contract negotiations. I’m more frustrated because I worry that this is impedeing progress in other areas. Soon we’ll hear Murray blame Ryan for the lack of offseason progress and Ducks fans will get even angrier at him. At that point, there will be no saving the relationship.

 Bobby mishandled this thing. He tried to use public support too soon and force Murray into the deal he wanted. Murray stuck to his guns. I don’t see Bobby comin out of this one with a clean face unless he takes less money. He played the game and he got beat. Take a little less money so you can make more when you walk 4 years from now. You have to spend money to make money, as they say.

by Daniel AC on Jul 7, 2010 1:26 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

Here is the problem. The Ducks cannot have Ryan/Perry/Getzlaf all become UFA’s the same year. If Bobby Ryan does not realize this and continues to push for this 3 year contract, he can take his greed and get traded. And unfortunately I do believe this is holding up Murry from signing another free agent defensman, which we dearly need. Maybe he Ryan will take Wiz with him.

by Pucky on Jul 7, 2010 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

If you’ve been listening to me, I apologize. Arthur has iterated many times that Bobby wants a 4 year deal not 3.

by Daniel AC on Jul 7, 2010 1:55 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

he’s on record saying he wants 4, not on record saying he wants 3. Maybe he really wants 10, who knows, I’m just saying let’s judge him by what he’s on record saying.

by Arthur from Anaheim Calling on Jul 7, 2010 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

Could we drop

the wild comparisons to Crosby? Of all the invectives hurled at Bobby, this one rankles me the most.

Has Bobby ever said or indicated (and boy howdy, do I want links to support) that he’s entitled to x amount of dollars at this stage in his career because he was drafted after Crosby? Is he asking for anything NEAR Crosby money?

Since I’m almost certain that the answers to both of these questions is a resounding “no,” can we PLEASE drop this line of attack. Its utterly absurd and it really does not reflect well on anyone that uses it.

Arthur and Daniel are right. Bobby misplayed his hand in the press. None of that changes the fact that he’s scored 30 plus goals over the past two years and that he’s arguably still improving. Players like that are valuable and he has every right to exercise the leverage granted through the CBA. God knows the team will use theirs.

There are greedy players and then there are guys who want a fair shake on a market team. I can almost predict the same thing will happen with Drew Doughty fairly shortly. Players have a right to be fairly compensated. The problem is that the “he’s a greedy superstar” is so easy and pervasive that you practically have to take well under market value if you don’t want to be accused of greed.

Did Bobby screw up here? Absolutely. Sbould we hate him for that? I certainly have a different answer to that question than others do but I really don’t think were at the point where we should just be shipping out a valuable player that really has not done anything egregiously wrong.

by PhantomPretender on Jul 7, 2010 1:48 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

When you lose a battle like this ou have to take your licks. If he’s holding up the off season for half a million dollars, that’s a problem. There’s wanting market value and then there’s refusing to compromise. Murray threw out two pretty reasonable options. Bobby lost, if he wants to stay in the fans’ good graces he should take the term he wants and realize there’s plenty of money out there when he goes UFA. Sometimes you have to ve an adult about these things.

by Daniel AC on Jul 7, 2010 2:07 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

I wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t hear any ‘Bobby! Bobby!’ chants next season. Unless of course, he stops being stubborn. You hit the nail on the head when you said ‘There’s wanting market value and then there’s refusing to compromise.’ At this point, he’s refusing to compromise.

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 7, 2010 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

He has already taken a big hit within the fanbase. I think he can come back from that but if he is to come back in favor of the fans. He has to act fast cause the time window for reversing the fanbase is closing fast.

by Newport Rebel on Jul 7, 2010 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

you can't blame a player for holding up the team. . .

it is an easy argument to make, but when you say that you are implying that the player is too good to lose or let walk, and if that is the case, then you should be looking to meet his demands.
Murray, just as much as Bobby is playing hard ball and in this case is more to blame for non-off season development. It is his job to know the market and the team’s needs. . . at this point in time he is making Bobby the priority, and thus, giving Ryan the advantage in price negotiations.

I think the fact that Murray is not going out an purchasing a D-man at the same time is telling. No matter how emphatically he says he won’t trade Ryan, there is a trade or two that he would be willing to make . . . and he is not shutting the door on those possibilities . . . at least not until Ryan is signed.

by breibird on Jul 12, 2010 12:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

that he’s arguably still improving

I don’t think anyone would argue that he’s still improving.

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 7, 2010 2:05 PM PDT reply actions  

I don’t think anyone would argue that he isn’t improving.

Sorry, definitely butchered that one.

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 7, 2010 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

But I think you can argue about what his limit is. Although Ryan is talented, I don’t think he is the “he can be as good as he wants” type of player like Getzlaf is. I’m pretty sure Ryan will reach 40 goals, but will he ever reach 50 goals? Will he ever reach 80 or 90 points? He definitely will improve, but how much is the real question.

by Wooster11 on Jul 7, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

Honest question

how many 40 goal scorers were there last year? How many have their been on average the past few years? And how many are Western conference guys?

I don’t think you can dismiss 40 goals all that easily, but that’s just me.

by PhantomPretender on Jul 7, 2010 2:45 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

You can’t. But then again, Bobby isn’t a 40 goal scorer.

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 7, 2010 2:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

To a degree, I think that’s just a matter of opinion. Personally, I think Bobby can improve to the point of being a consistent 100-point-a-season player. The potential is there, but it remains to be seen whether or not he reaches it. I’m sure some people would disagree, but as I said it’s a matter of opinion.

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 7, 2010 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Paying for potential is a dangerous business. I stuck to my previous statements. Bobby can take over a game, but he hasn’t shown that he can take over a series.

by Daniel AC on Jul 7, 2010 3:09 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

Teams have to pay for potential now. It’s been that way for a few years now.

by GOOLIAN on Jul 8, 2010 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

I’m aware. However, teams get to choose how much they are willing to pay for that potential. I’m really just trying to point out that paying for potential complicates these matters, since potential is so unpredictable.

by Daniel AC on Jul 8, 2010 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

like it or not he is and will be an important player on out team think about how great a season the rpg line could have when the ducks are not killed by injuries. ryan was constantly moved off the line with teemu and lupul out

by Joe Holub on Jul 7, 2010 5:07 PM PDT reply actions  

According to Dobber Hockey, Ryan actually played 39.88% of his even strength time with the Getzlaf and Perry, and as I recall he was taken off the line for chemistry as much as anything else. The Ryan of last year’s playoffs who was willing to bang and open up room for Getz and Pears, as Fedoruk or Penner had done for them, and crash the net was great. This year, there was a lot more cuteness, and the line often looked smoother with Beleskey in there and even a little more dangerous with Lupul in there. Not saying Ryan can’t get back to the chemistry they had last year, but him not being on the top line half of the time this season, based on his early season attitude, was no great loss.

by Arthur from Anaheim Calling on Jul 7, 2010 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

why can’t we just have all our scoring lines set instead of flip-flopping like crazy. how bout this if bobby comes back:
Bobby-Getz-Perry
Blake-Koivu-Selanne
Marchant-Chipchura-Bodie
I have no idea in hell who is going to play with Parros on the fourth line
Sorry Lupul you don’t work with Selanne even if you are a good player. We got Etem and Sexton coming

by Albert K on Jul 7, 2010 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately, Marchant seems to be nothing, but dead weight. Marchant seems to fill the same niche as Chipchura, Chip being significantly better priced. The presence of both of them together in our bottom 6, really prevents us from setting up a real third scoring line. As neither of them nor Carter are good candidates to center a scoring line.

[End extremely off topic rant]

You seem to be forgetting about Beleskey.

We need more Boyntons.

by yankeeken on Jul 7, 2010 11:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think Belesky could use some ahl time just a bit to improve his plus/minus

by Albert K on Jul 8, 2010 6:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

I’m not sure that’s the best use of Ryan at this point. Sleek put together some pretty compelling statistics of all lines playing better with Ryan on board.

I’m too lazy to look for it, but I remember reading it.

by GOOLIAN on Jul 8, 2010 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think that was two seasons ago, and definitely true then. Carlyle tried to juggle him onto the line last season as often as possible, and it just wasn’t always clicking. With Carlyle at the helm, he’ll be juggled back, but I don’t think we should assume he was kicked off because of injury. There were plenty of times where things just weren’t clicking, and certainly times when other guys did better.

by Arthur from Anaheim Calling on Jul 8, 2010 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

Three scoring lines?? Ryan on the wing

Beleskey was good on the top line, learning as he went, that spot should be up for grabs….the Masterton line wasa clicking if Teemu returns they are set, Ryan (if he ever signs) could put up giant numbers on a third SCORING line with Chipchura and Marchant ….Bodie’s spot is still on the 4th line, esp. now that Brown is gone, we have some deciding to do for center, Carter may be trade fodder, as he is not a checker, but is not high enough in the order to ruin a third scoring line/pk line. Can we ever field a third scoring line with RC in charge? Until camp is going can’t make any plans for the prospects…just playing RC’s role of “never play the rookies” that is why Sexton is not included in all this.

by Buick22 on Jul 8, 2010 10:28 AM PDT reply actions  

Ummm I know this is off topic but I heard some people over at the OC Register saying Carter is on the waiver wire….

by Albert K on Jul 8, 2010 12:59 PM PDT reply actions  

Yup. This is upsetting for me. I never liked the fact that Randy scratched him so often. I hope he gets a chance to play somewhere else.

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 8, 2010 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

I gotta feeling hes gonna be claimed by some team that will make Randy look like an idiot just like what happened with Drew Miller

by Albert K on Jul 8, 2010 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

oc register cursed him by doing that feature on him.

by Arthur from Anaheim Calling on Jul 8, 2010 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

I was thinking the same thing :[

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 8, 2010 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

if he’s on waivers why isn’t it on the ducks official site? wow even the site sucks lol

by Albert K on Jul 8, 2010 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

just wondering when you’re updating the new prospects list after the draft and all the college free-sagent signings?

by Albert K on Jul 8, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

I know a couple of times I said that I though Carter had the potential to be a Selke finalist. He’s such a smart defensive player. He has good size and strong offensive upside. This is very disappointing for me. I wouldn’t have minded a third scoring line of Beleskey, Carter, Sexton. I think he could have been very productive like that.

by Daniel AC on Jul 8, 2010 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think if Anaheim were to roll a third scoring line that would be it

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 8, 2010 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Eh.. Detroit claimed Drew because of the injury troubles they had last season. And it’s not as if Drew has become an all-world Red Wing. He’s still just a bottom 6 guy.. I don’t imagine Carter will become a top 6 guy anywhere else either

There's nothing to see here. And nothing gazes back at me.

by Natesaduck on Jul 8, 2010 1:19 PM PDT reply actions  

Great post — I guess I should note that I haven’t paid great attention to this back-and-forth (for some reason I am way too patient this offseason), but it is still media-delivered fronting. I’m just hoping it resolves itself without too much of my concentration — off to kill more cowboys!

"Ridin’ The Meat Train & Dreaming of Jack’s Johnson All Summer Long!"
http://www.battleofcali.com/

by Earl Sleek on Jul 10, 2010 7:47 AM PDT reply actions  

haha. When talks stopped, I know you were on the ‘wait and see’ side, and that’s really not a bad side to be as this will likely resolve itself, but I just got the feeling we were in for a long one when it was shaping up to be a term war, so I couldn’t help but get anxious. Now I’m kind of fatigued and joining you on the ‘wait and see’ side. Ah well. Maybe I, too, should buy Red Dead.

by Arthur from Anaheim Calling on Jul 10, 2010 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

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