Duck U: RIV 102 – Nashville Predators
by Chris D-5 on Nov 12, 2011 10:00 AM PST
in Duck U
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As I walked into Honda Center Wednesday night, I had a plan. I was going to pick a Duck and focus on him whenever he was on the ice and do my best to break down his game for you kind readers. That will have to wait, because before the first TV timeout Nashville was up 2-0 and the beer in my hand became the first of many. So instead it's the second installment of Duck U: RIV 101 - Nashville Predators.
I am a hockey addict. To support my addiction I have a full time job. While I'm there I do anything I can to immerse myself in the game; mostly this means piping a constant stream of hockey talk directly into my brain by listening to NHL Home Ice on my phone's Sirius/XM app. There usually isn't a whole lot of Ducks talk on the station, and when there is it can get repetitive. If I had a dollar for every time I heard the phrase "arguably the best line in hockey" ... but I digress. The Ducks/Preds game being one of three Wednesday and the pre-game chirping bought us some air time.
As the "War of Words" heated up, the game was hyped as a grudge match - a budding rivalry between two non-traditional markets and a rematch of last year's grueling playoff series (which nobody watched because Chicago was playing Vancouver). At first I was reluctant to admit it, but there does seem to be the makings of a rivalry between Anaheim and Nashville. They've played in the playoffs, the players clearly have a healthy distaste for one another and, I don't know about you guys but I have some issues with the Nashville fans.
There are two problems with this being a rivalry, though. First, is there isn't really any competitive balance. The Ducks can't seem to beat the Preds. Since the beginning of last season they've played 12 times and Nashville has won nine. Not only that, as a team they score a lot of goals against the Ducks. In those 12 games, the Preds have averaged 3.83 goals. For perspective, last year they averaged 2.57 against the other 28 teams combined.
The other thing working against the Ducks/Preds "rivalry" is that it's so petty and childish. It's only been a few months and I'm sick of it already. Wysh wrote about it. Eric Stephens wrote about it. Jeff Miller wrote about it. Adam Brady wrote about it. Jen wrote about it . Reader detroitsucks13 wrote about it. And now I'm writing about it.
With that kind of coverage you'd think it was some huge controversy eroding the very fabric of the game, but here's a synopsis:
- Getzlaf 10/30: Tootoo dives!
- Getzlaf 11/8: No seriously, Tootoo is a diver!
- Tootoo 11/9: That's my job, sucker!
- Trotz 11/9: The Ducks all take cheap shots away from the play! And they're whiners!
- Getzlaf 11/10: You're a stinky jerk-face!
- Trotz 11/10: I'm rubber, you're glue ...
I may have made those last two up, but they're not out of place. To make matters worse with all this whining, they're all legitimate arguments. The Preds dive all over the place, the Ducks get away with as much as they can, Getzy is whining and has more pressing issues to worry about on the ice, and Jordin Tootoo is a stinky jerk face. We went through all of this in the spring. It reminds me of Night at the Roxbury. I didn't like it in small doses. Why would I want to sit through 90 minutes of it?
Speaking of annoying things, I know I'm asking for it here based on the game thread comments but, why does every chant in Nashville's arena end with some variation of the word suck? I can handle a "Ref You Suck!" or even that stupid Addams Family song at Staples, but the Preds fans take it to another level.
"Hiiiiiilll-eeeeeer! Hiiiiiilll-eeeeeer! YOU SUCK!"
Thanks for clearing that up. I thought the sing song chanting of his name meant you like him.
Even after they score: "Yay! We scored! You SUCK!"
So ... You're better than someone who sucks ... congratulations? I don't get it.
It seems to be a really fun, unique atmosphere in Nashville and I'd love to go to a game there one day, but I just can't stand that aspect of the crowd.
Now that I've gotten myself all riled up about it, I can admit that there is some ground work for a rivalry between these two teams, but for now, with all due respect to Kevin Lowe and the catch phrase over at BoC, it's probably the most pathetic rivalry in the NHL.
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For starters
We’re still pissed our Puck Daddy eulogy sucked.
Embrace the Black and Blue Checkerboard.
by ExcellenceThroughGuesswork on Nov 12, 2011 10:30 AM PST reply actions
Hey, thanks for that. I always like reading how much I suck when I do something for the first time.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Managing Editor - Anaheim Calling
You may not accept this, but it's the truth...
All the “suck” business we in Nashville engage in is only in the spirit of having a fun time at the game. It’s not and never has been borne of malicious intent. Anyone who has attended a game here in Nashville wearing the opposite team’s jersey will attest to this. It’s a college atmosphere at Preds games, which is why just about everyone who visits us remarks about what a fun vibe there is at Preds home games.
That being said, aside from the obvious verbal pokes, we treat our guests with respect; nobody gets hassled for wearing the visitor’s colors; extremely few fans ever get removed for any kind of disorderly behavior; it’s a family-friendly circumstance, because we want everyone to have a good time, we want you to come back, and we want Nasville to be a fun destination for out-of-towners; but above all we want our team to win and make no apologies for it.
I do hope you can make your way to Music City for a game sometime, Chris; you might be surprised. I lived in Long Beach for 22 years and have now been in Nashville for 20 more; it was the best move I ever made.
As far as the rivalry goes, the alleged diving wouldn’t be near an issue if the Ducks, as you admit to, didn’t push the envelope of good sportsmanship and take as many cheap shots as they do. They seem to ascribe to the ‘if ya can’t beat ‘em, beat ’em up’ approach to trying to defeat the Preds, only Nashville isn’t the physical pushover they may have been in previous years.
But Brookbank ‘accidentally’ de-grilling Marty Erat; Getzlaf’s stomping on Jon Blum’s foot, and the incredibly gratuitous cheap shots directed at Tootoo aren’t isolated incidents; they’re an accepted culture in Anaheim; you and I both know that. So please don’t expect the Preds to just sit there and take it. Even still, for a “team full of divers,” Nashville doesn’t seem to get many called, do they?
I’ll never blindly try to say that Toots doesn’t occasionally play up the drama a little, but at least since the playoffs last year, he has shown incredible restraint in taking what the Ducks have dished out. And I don’t believe there are too many guys on your squad who would want to test him in a fight.
But if you saw Perry’s spear job live,as I did, followed by Getzlaf going over and slashing Tootoo (hard) while he was still down on the ice (and not getting called for it, BTW), you might thing a little differently about the whole situation. That entire sequence was never shown on TV (I watched the replay of your broadcast later that night). But either way, the Preds/Ducks is a rivalry, sucky or no, and I look forward to hopefully some cleaner battles in the future. :)
Thanks for your comments. I always love hearing reasonable arguments.
A couple things:
*First, Bobby Ryan stomped on Jonathan Blum, not Getz. Blum, incidentally, from the city where I grew up.
*Second, I would LOVE to go to Nashville for a game. The atmosphere looks like soooo much fun! Plus, I consider myself a BBQ aficionado. I don’t mind the ‘you suck’ stuff. It’s a crowd thing. I wish our crowd was as into it as Preds fans are.
*Third, none of us on AC (or in Ducks fandom) would disagree that the Ducks play a physical game. Perry and Getzlaf do have questionable behaviors on the ice which give them the competitive advantage because it pisses people off. Is it ethical? No, but neither is flopping around the ice to get a call. It’s simply competitive advantage that every team tries to obtain to increase their chance of winning. I saw the spear Getzlaf gave Tootoo on the broadcast. The difference is that Getz made the move and was ready to drop the gloves with Tootoo (or anyone on Nashville for that matter). If Tootoo wants to play that way against the Ducks, he needs to have the decency to drop the gloves the next shift. Perry, Getz and Bobby will do that every time to back up what they did. It makes us cringe that they do because losing one of them in exchange for a lesser player on the other team, but the decision is there to go. With the exception of a very few guys on the team (like Selanne, Koivu, Fowler, and Visnovsky), most would fight with Tootoo. We don’t earn the most fighting majors every season without reason.
"I'm not a lady. I'm a DUCK!" - Connie Moreau, D2: Mighty Ducks
Managing Editor - Anaheim Calling
I live right pursued of Long Beach, I’ve been to Nashville, it’s a bad move.
As I’ve said many times, the Ducks don’t do anything other teams don’t do. They might do a little more of it, but that seems a little irrelevant to me. Is a person who robs 4 people really any better than a person who robs 5. The only thing that makes the Dicks play anymore or less dirty is the constant referencing to it as dirty. Language frames reality.
by Daniel AC on Nov 12, 2011 1:32 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
There is definitely potential for a Ducks-Preds rivalry
but I don’t think we’re quite there yet. I think that we will need to see the Preds a few more times in the postseason to really call it a ‘rivalry.’
The ‘sucks’ business is definitely a college hockey thing, too. The YPMB (Yale’s hockey pep band) yells it after each member of our opponent’s starting lineup is announced.
Contributor - Anaheim Calling
by light_the_lamp on Nov 12, 2011 11:40 AM PST reply actions
Yeah, and that’s where it came from and we do it for every team. It’s become a tradition, pulled from people who moved from Michigan and other northerly places, and local fans of the old minor and college teams.
We do the “sucks” during the opposing lineup too, you just don’t see that part on TV. The coach gets a “and he sucks too”. It’s just all in good fun.
Yeah I guess, but it doesn’t make it any less annoying
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take."
-Wayne Gretzky
-Michael Scott
http://district5hockey.wordpress.com/
Contributor: Anaheim Calling, Hockeytalk.biz
@district5hockey on Twitter
by Chris D-5 on Nov 12, 2011 12:35 PM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
It certainly explains a lot about how your team plays.
by Daniel AC on Nov 12, 2011 1:33 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Maybe the best piece on our rivalry I’ve seen on here – I mostly agree. The talk is childish; keep it on the ice. Tootoo’s a pest, so is Hornqvist in his way. What they do seems to work, so they keep doing it. Also, the Ducks lack the defense or consistent goal-tending right now to stay in the game against a strong defensive team.
I hate cheap crap behind the play, but I didn’t see much of that the last game. I was wrong on the Fisher hit, and luckily he only got the most minor of concussions. Kudos to the ref seeing that as it was, because it took a still photo of the hit for me to see that it was just accidentally to the head.
But, like the hit to Smith-Pelly in the game you guys had against the Canucks? That looked pretty unnecessary and dangerous (as he didn’t even really have a chance to play the puck) and should get a good look at from Shanahan.
I think the main reason the Preds have our number is because they are our polar opposites.
Where we lolligag in our zone, they consistently and constantly send wave after wave of persistent players in to try to get it. Their forecheckers are tenacious and will score if they get the puck.
Where we lackadaisically try to forecheck they get the friggin puck out of the zone. Where we do not have a clear #1 and #2 defenseman they have penultimate Shea Weber and Ryan Suter, which may be one reason why they can get the puck out of their zone.
Where our last defense is Swiss cheese at times Hiller they have the gynormous brick wall Pekka Rinne who is the smaller of their two tenders.
Where their team faceoff mentality…well you get the picture. They are the complete opposite of our bunch. They have no-name talent that knows they have to work hard each and every shift for every inch of ice. The Ducks feel like it is their right to make pretty plays, score and win.
It’s sad really. As much as I HATE the flopping and the fact Tootoo won’t drop the gloves even though he used to, I respect their work ethic. Trotz has some kind of work hard potion that I wish Carlyle would find someday. All you have to do is look at the last game, we can’t even respect our team for their effort in a win…
I've been trying to decide whether to say anything here.
The standard I’ve tried to set for myself on commenting is “will it make the conversation a better conversation?” and I’m not all that sure that commenting on this topic will do so. That said, I love sports rivalries. They’re fun. They make games interesting when there’s no other reason for them to be interesting. Sports hate is an excellent way to channel all the aggression built up in your daily life into something acceptable and essentially harmless and meaningless so that it dissipates without you or your spouse having to sleep on the sofa.
And I have to be honest. I hate the Ducks. I hate, hate, hate them, in a very active and lively sports hate. I even know why. Corey @#$% Perry speared my goalie. Twice. My beloved Pekka. Right in the hoo-hoo. No I will never forgive that. Goalies are sacred, you know. Except for Dan Ellis, who crapped all over my other team, the Tampa Bay Lightning, which is just another reason to hate the Ducks.
The foot-stomping I could eventually have forgiven, even though Blummer is basically like that pesky little brother who follows you around everywhere and annoys the pee out of you, but whom you’d defend to the death if anyone looked funny at him. The crazy, dumb hit on Erat by the crazy Jarkko Ruutu—well, I could have learned to live with that, because it’s not like Erat doesn’t get broken a dozen times a season. And Tootoo? Well, Tootoo dives, especially when we play Anaheim. I love my little bowling ball, but if anyone else knocks him over, he just gets back up. In a game with Anaheim, it’s like he loses all skeletal support whenever someone comes near him.
So, yeah, it comes down to two things—one, Pekka, and I’m afraid there’s just no coming back from that one, guys. And two, comments made here on AC and elsewhere by Anaheim fans hoping for serious injury to Preds players and defending attempts to hurt/injure with the tired old saw that it’s just part of the game. That really, really crosses the line. Y’all find the “You suck” stuff classless and annoying? Fair enough. I find wishing for an opposing goalie to be concussed to be classless and annoying.
In the end, although I hate your team, I hate within boundaries. I hope for them to have fulfilling personal lives. I don’t hope for serious injury to befall any player, regardless of the uniform he wears. What I want is for your team, and especially Corey @#$% Perry, is for them to lose, to lose badly, and to lose often, especially to my team. And I sort of expect the same from you.
I’d call that a healthy rivalry.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Part Predator, part Lightning.
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
It’s all interpretation really. “Wishing” injury is a matter of perspective. I’m pretty sure I made a comment about him being concussed. If you want to say something, then say it. But don’t beat around the bush, like your team. I’ve seen equally disconcerting comments over at on the forecheck. As a Ducks fan, nothing infuriates me more than this illusion that we engage in some classless tactics that other fans or team don’t. Get off your self righteous stump and say something relevant. Otherwise, you aren’t contributing to the conversation.
To me, this is the essence of the problem here.
I never intended to attack you personally, and yet somehow the wires got crossed. If there’s some part of what I said that came across as a personal attack, I apologize. It was unintentional. I meant to say exactly what I said and nothing more. Wishing for a player to get injured crosses the line of good sportsmanship, and it makes me angry when anyone does it or defends it as okay when it happens. For myself, when I see something like that at OtF, I call people on it. Perhaps some people do that here, too, and I haven’t seen it. If so, I apologize for that, as well. I tried to inject some levity and get a conversation going, but I really don’t want to get called names, so I won’t invade your space any further.
The only other thing to say is that if you guys get a Preds troll on your thread again, please let us know. We don’t like to see that on our threads either. I don’t know what I could do about it, but maybe we could try.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Part Predator, part Lightning.
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
This is, in essence, my problem with the Predators fans that come here. You don’t come here to contribute to the conversation. You come here to talk down to us. You create arbitrary lines in the sand and wonder why we don’t see it the same as you do. It is, in a way, ethnocentrism. There’s this sentiment that Abaheim fans are bad fans and Nashville fans are good fans/ people.
No you didn’t personally attack me by name. However, you said you don’t like people wishing injury to another player and cited someone talking about Rinne get a concussion. I owned that comment. Therefore, you have a problem with me. Do you not? More importantly, you use a literal definition of the comment in order to back your negative opinion. You are framing. You have a negativ perspective and seek out negative evidence to support it. You know nothing about my intentions with that comment. Maybe it was part of the hate you legitimize with your comments about team rivalries. But looking at it from that angle wouldn’t allow you to come here and tell us what’s wrong with us.
Finally, we’ll deal with trolls here the way we see fit, because it is our board. We do not need on the forecheck to do anything for us in this matter. This is another example of your inability to see us as equals. This is our thread and we’ll do things the way we want. Save your lectures for people who don’t know any netter.
by Daniel AC on Nov 14, 2011 7:39 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Re: Trolls
I wrote my comment below before reading your post, so maybe it’s not really applicable anymore (or, at least not to you), but that’s okay. Please, deal with the trolls as you see fit. That’s fine with me! I think the purpose behind wanting to know about the existence of our own trolls is that it gives us the opportunity to watch for them in the future – ON OtF – and call them out/reprimand them/etc. for their actions. It’s not JUST an Anaheim Calling thing (at least not for me). It’s the general presentation of our fan base to any and all of the blogs being trolled.
Hands go uuppp..... AND THEY STAY THERE!
-nashvillepredators-
And once again I've put my foot in it.
I wasn’t trying to say “the problem with AC” but rather “the problem that we are experiencing between our two groups of fans.” Saying it the way I said it made it sound really insincere and awful. I should have proofread much more carefully. We seem to misunderstand one another often (our group and your group, that is), and the way I worded that didn’t help. Again, I apologize.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Part Predator, part Lightning.
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
The only other thing to say is that if you guys get a Preds troll on your thread again, please let us know. We don’t like to see that on our threads either. I don’t know what I could do about it, but maybe we could try.
Yes – please do this. I hate to think that we have some d****ebag “fan” wandering around SBN, pissing other fans off, and making us ALL look bad. Let us know if buzzed (or anyone else) comes back, and we’ll call him out. Sometimes, nothing works quite as well as having your remarks openly and bluntly rejected by people who support the same thing you “support”.
Hands go uuppp..... AND THEY STAY THERE!
-nashvillepredators-
As a critical scholar, I try not to tell people how to use their space. I regulate what happens here because this is my community. That’s the only sentiment I wish to get across. This is a space for Ducks fans to discuss hockey and other who wish to discuss out hickey with us. However, as I said before, this is OUR space. We shouldn’t have to be talked down to by members who are not from our community. That is not to say others are unwelcome. Rather those who show respect will be respected, and those who do not shall receive non in return.
That’s how redo things here, and other blogs can do things how they want. I won’t tell another person how to run his/her boards.
by Daniel AC on Nov 14, 2011 1:31 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
On a more generalized note...
I know I’ve mentioned this before, but I don’t usually comment on other team’s blogs, etc. etc. I DO really appreciate this post though. It’s healthy for everyone to openly admit obnoxious things about your team – especially when there’s such close contact between fans. However, while I initially enjoyed the fan-to-fan communication, the way everyone is handling opposing fans is really starting to annoy me (and that isn’t an easy feat).
What I wish, is that EVERYONE (and I do mean everyone) would just calm the crap down! I know everyone hates each other, but that’s no reason to go all “he said this, she said that, nyah-nyah-nyah, you’re stupid, you’re ugly, I’m telling my mom, I’m telling my dad, you over-analyze, you’re violent, you dive, you’re dirty” on each other. I think we all just need to take everything in stride, and recognize that when we (royal “we”) go to another blog, we’re going to see comments that ew don’t agree with and comments that are going to piss us off! I think we both have posters who handle reading such things well, and posters who take things more personally, but either way, most people seem to become defensive immediately. Guess what? OtF and AC both trash-talk each other. Woo! We are obnoxious. You are obnoxious. We dive unnecessarily. You have some dirty play. By now, we should expect to see these comments from each other! Not all Preds’ fans are terrible, annoying, human beings! Neither are all Ducks’ fans! Come on. We all know that title belongs to Red Wings’ fans :)
I guess what I’m getting at is the following request (for both my friends at OtF and you guys here at AC): when one of us goes over to the other’s blog, maybe we could start showing some of this respect that seems to be lacking in our actual games. Unless someone is truly hard-core trolling, can’t we all just respect each other? Stop taking every little thing as a personal attack (I have seen this happen many times, on both blogs, from both fan-bases), stop goading each other, and agree to disagree before things go too far!
And I think it’s kind of funny that after writing all of this, I want to make sure to specify my intent before I go, but here it is: This is not at all an attack on AC. I dislike, but honestly do respect, your team and your fans. I just want my Preds/Ducks GDT experiences to be less aggressive and guarded and more fun and entertaining. I hope everyone sees where I’m coming from, and perhaps we can continue to make this into an equally as serious, but simply less agressive, rivalry.
Hands go uuppp..... AND THEY STAY THERE!
-nashvillepredators-
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